Maybe the most "dedicated" shippers downloaded it and so now we're on the less violently fannish?

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(I think this because second-wave wank is always relatively mild in any fandom.)

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You are quite possibly right about this. I have to admit I have some slight second wave bias in my exposure to HP fandom, which never seems to ease up.

And, as I mentioned, there's an awful lot of "Never seen Doctor Who before, but I loved this ep" people.

Also, given the reputation this episode had, perhaps people were expecting something more... extreme than we got.

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You can hate GitF without shipping Doctor/Rose, but there's a bit of a correlation. The most hardcore would have *ahem* "obtained" the ep when it aired over here.


And yes, the rep set up expectations of HORROR and WOE like the Doctor was going to marry the French chick and then tell Rose that he always hated her even when he was Nine, and then she'd tell him she was gay anyway.

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I think the correlation is less shipping Doctor/Rose, and more being a big fan of Rose. Because she's quite sidelined in this ep.

But yes, very definite correlation. (Side not: of all the criticism, one that I have never seen come from anyone who wasn't a shipper was bashing Sophia's acting)

I am actually sort of amused at how the initial massive overreaction (because it so was), actually has made the episode seemed more subtle and all. Weirdly enough, the fact people initially freaked has apparently made the episode seem better for some.

Also, we have a few people whom the episode have grown on

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I think the correlation is less shipping Doctor/Rose, and more being a big fan of Rose. Because she's quite sidelined in this ep.

True. Do I imagine it or are the Doctorfen also a bit more open about other pairings? Cos they watch for him and his emo manpain.


Side not: of all the criticism, one that I have never seen come from anyone who wasn't a shipper was bashing Sophia's acting

I didn't think she was amazing, but there's been far worse on the show. She does good with what she's given, and pulls off the age thing pretty well.


Weirdly enough, the fact people initially freaked has apparently made the episode seem better for some.

Cos it's not actually bad and doesn't kill the other ship? I think GitF would be a lot worse in a show like House where there's less textual shipping overall.

PS: Is it a failure on Rusty's part that Rose and Mickey are placed to end up together but no one in the fandom ships them?

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Do I imagine it or are the Doctorfen also a bit more open about other pairings? Cos they watch for him and his emo manpain.

I have suspcions that way, but haven't seen enough of fandom to back that up. And it doesn't really go for the asexualist fans, naturally. I also recall that a couple of Nine/Rose fans seemed to really like this ep. Weird.

I didn't think she was amazing, but there's been far worse on the show. She does good with what she's given, and pulls off the age thing pretty well.

I didn't find her bad at all, but I am hopeless at judging bad acting. The writing's very different to what Rose got - much more stylised. Which does, really, work with the character - trained to be poised and literate and in control. Different eras and cultures and all that.

Cos it's not actually bad and doesn't kill the other ship? I think GitF would be a lot worse in a show like House where there's less textual shipping overall.

People reacted as if Reinette went and seduced the Doctor, and they got it on whilst Rose was forced to clean the floor or something. When in fact she never even saw them kiss.

PS: Is it a failure on Rusty's part that Rose and Mickey are placed to end up together but no one in the fandom ships them?

I don't think it's so much failure as the fact rathet too many shippers look down on Mickey as not good enough. Or after S2, as being too good for Rose and busy with Jake

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I have suspcions that way, but haven't seen enough of fandom to back that up. And it doesn't really go for the asexualist fans, naturally. I also recall that a couple of Nine/Rose fans seemed to really like this ep. Weird.

We can always discount asexualists. Cos they don't really do LJ anyway.

I only just realised that if one's shipping Nine/Rose hardcore, all the focus on Ten/Rose where the Consummate Their Love is basically saying "Your ship didn't get sexxination." Hm. I wonder if that's an issue?


People reacted as if Reinette went and seduced the Doctor, and they got it on whilst Rose was forced to clean the floor or something. When in fact she never even saw them kiss.

Rose is left out of the loop, which is ow, but it could have been worse.


I don't think it's so much failure as the fact rathet too many shippers look down on Mickey as not good enough. Or after S2, as being too good for Rose and busy with Jake

Yeah, it's like fandom's split between thinking one or the other isn't good enough. Even though now they could fight aliens together and have hawt sex in alt!Torchwood Tower. On the desks.

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I only just realised that if one's shipping Nine/Rose hardcore, all the focus on Ten/Rose where the Consummate Their Love is basically saying "Your ship didn't get sexxination." Hm. I wonder if that's an issue?

It might.. rub things in a bit. See: theorising from chattiness the other night.

Rose is left out of the loop, which is ow, but it could have been worse.

And people reacted like it was the worse.

Yeah, it's like fandom's split between thinking one or the other isn't good enough. Even though now they could fight aliens together and have hawt sex in alt!Torchwood Tower. On the desks.

HAWT. Especially if Jake was also involved. (That crackfic was lolarious)

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It might.. rub things in a bit. See: theorising from chattiness the other night.

It means Nine didn't love her enough to tell her so. And we all know that's the only thing that matters.


And people reacted like it was the worse.

Yet no one cared when Ten gayed at the Face of Boe. Bipedalists!


HAWT. Especially if Jake was also involved.

Alt!OT3 ftw!

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It means Nine didn't love her enough to tell her so. And we all know that's the only thing that matters.

Of course. Which is why certain people want Rose to come solely for a "real kiss" or an actual declaration of love.

Yet no one cared when Ten gayed at the Face of Boe. Bipedalists!

Dude, no-one cared when Ten kissed Mickey, either. There so should be more Ten/Mickey slash.

Alt!OT3 ftw!

Things what Rose learnt from the Doctor: Kink, baby.

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Which is why certain people want Rose to come solely for a "real kiss" or an actual declaration of love.

And then... she dies? What happens after that?

Dude, no-one cared when Ten kissed Mickey, either. There so should be more Ten/Mickey slash.

Boys don't count.

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What happens after that?

It's irrelevant. Srsly. All they care about is getting that kiss or "I love you".

Boys don't count.

Sometimes this fandom truly does feel alien.

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It's irrelevant. Srsly. All they care about is getting that kiss or "I love you".

"I love you, Rose. Let's have a quick snog. Then I've got to get back to Martha before she gets bored and puts her clothes on again."

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They really don't think these things through properly, do they?

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Rusty seems to have not wanted them to kiss. Maybe that's just so as not to squick the kids?

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He seems quite aware how it would be taken by different segments of the fandom.

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Speaking of crazy, Jacob just put the recaplet up. It's kind of... well, I fear the actual recap, is all I can say. It would appear that his love for this episode is without bounds.

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... the Hell?

That said, it's nice to have someone who appears to have the respect, at least, of a certain amount of Rosefen on the pro-GitF side, as it were. Despite his means of getting things across. *waves flag of GitF love*

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Either they had seen it before, and took note of Jacob's warning notice and stayed away, or, yeah, avoided the ep.

I am not hugely familiar with either of those fandoms, alas.

Why couldn't she be that mature and understanding in the fic about this episode, that's what I want to know.

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You can't use "It was just an excuse for Tennant to get his girlfriend on the show" as a criticism.

I've seen some of that floating around in various places too. *headdesks*

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iIt's just... if you are going to criticise the episode, can't you at least get your facts straght?

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